Agrobacterium as a Suspected CAUSE - EPA documents have been recently updated!!!

[tcmgpt13]

More information for those interested in reading some of Venetia's post. A lot of links:

Originally Posted by Venetia

Mae-Wan Ho has been warning the world about Agrobacterium Ti since at least 2000.

She has warned of pesticides as well.

Recent Evidence Confirms Risks of Horizontal Gene Transfer

The Institute of Science In Society

ISIS News no. 6, Sept 2000

Ban Glyphosate Herbicides Now

Mae-Wan Ho points out that Scientists should be held responsible.....

Scientists Must be Held Responsible and Protected by Law

She fears the Collapse of Civilization....

Why Civilisations Collapse

But she gives us direction....

Medicine in a New Key

Citovsky gave us a heads up- in terms of the response that will be given as relates
to Agrobacterium Ti and it's effects on humans.

Anyone who wishes to persue action to bring those effects to light I say do it. Go for it.

At the same time, we have to look at this from a different perspective as well. How to

Stop the effects of the Agro.


Dr Stricker provided Vitaly Citovsky samples - from Morgellons sufferers (biopsies) back in 2006.

When results were published, Vitaly Citovsky responded:

http://www.morgellonshope.com/index2...o_pdf=1&id=754

So that, as they say, is that.

We can continue to research and document and I'm sure that is a good idea- but
we should also look for our own way out of this fiasco.

Which is the path that I choose to take.

-V-

Additional informative posts and links to more information on agrobacterium on this thread: Can we STOP the Agrobacterium Ti Process ?

[Venetia]

Originally Posted by tcmgpt13

More information for those interested in reading some of Venetia's post. A lot of links:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Venetia View Post
Mae-Wan Ho has been warning the world about Agrobacterium Ti since at least 2000.

She has warned of pesticides as well.

Recent Evidence Confirms Risks of Horizontal Gene Transfer

The Institute of Science In Society

ISIS News no. 6, Sept 2000

Ban Glyphosate Herbicides Now

Mae-Wan Ho points out that Scientists should be held responsible.....

Scientists Must be Held Responsible and Protected by Law

She fears the Collapse of Civilization....

Why Civilisations Collapse

But she gives us direction....

Medicine in a New Key

Citovsky gave us a heads up- in terms of the response that will be given as relates
to Agrobacterium Ti and it's effects on humans.

Anyone who wishes to persue action to bring those effects to light I say do it. Go for it.

At the same time, we have to look at this from a different perspective as well. How to

Stop the effects of the Agro.


Dr Stricker provided Vitaly Citovsky samples - from Morgellons sufferers (biopsies) back in 2006.

When results were published, Vitaly Citovsky responded:

http://www.morgellonshope.com/index2...o_pdf=1&id=754

So that, as they say, is that.

We can continue to research and document and I'm sure that is a good idea- but
we should also look for our own way out of this fiasco.

Which is the path that I choose to take.

-V-

Additional informative posts and links to more information on agrobacterium on this thread: Can we STOP the Agrobacterium Ti Process ?

I wondered why my post came up on this particular thread with a caption:

More information for those interested in reading some of Venetia's post. [sic] posts.....

There could not be MORE unless there were some.....

Could only be that it is being inferred that I posted all the above- leading people to

Precision Herbs.

Not true- not even close. (nice try)

A little research on your own forum shows who, in the past, has recommended Dr Overman and

his company- Precision Herbs:

Dr Kolb in Atlanta, Dr Overman in Ohio

I purchase my herbals from various companies and get no $$$ or discount for referrals.

[tcmgpt13]

Venetia I was only trying to show that you have already done a lot of research on agrobacterium. Kind of sorry now that I bothered. I thought you would like others to know how much you posted on your thread about this subject. You made more than one post there about Agrobacterium. So there is more info on your thread about Agrob. I did not think I should copy every one of them.

I am not inferring you have anything to do with Overman or Precision herbs. I don't have anything to do with them either. I have never doubted your integrity.

Would you like me to remove my post here which copies your post? I will be more than happy to do that if you think your agrob thread posted here will connect you to PH or O. I certainly did not think when I posted this that you were in anyway connected to PH. I just thought it showed interesting links to and information about agrob. So just let me know if you want it removed.

Oh, my goodness when I was typing I left out an s? You point out a typo? If we all start that sort of silliness we will be years correcting spelling, punctuation, grammatical and typing errors made by posters for the last four or five years.

Originally Posted by Venetia

I wondered why my post came up on this particular thread with a caption:

More information for those interested in reading some of Venetia's post. [sic] posts.....

There could not be MORE unless there were some.....

Could only be that it is being inferred that I posted all the above- leading people to

Precision Herbs.

Not true- not even close. (nice try)

A little research on your own forum shows who, in the past, has recommended Dr Overman and

his company- Precision Herbs:

Dr Kolb in Atlanta, Dr Overman in Ohio

I purchase my herbals from various companies and get no $$$ or discount for referrals.

[Enviro Girl]

Hi Cyn!

I hope there aren't more pesticides directly involved in Morgellon's Contraction.

I already cried about The Flavus last night

So, before I look, cuz I'm done reading technical documents (waaaaah):

- Have this pesticide's ingredients been found in more than 1 Morgellon's patient's skin or blood?
- What locations?
- When?
- What is the contraction theory you/others have correlated?
- Are you in the U.S. here? If so, can you pls go look @ the Pesticide Fact Sheet(s) on what you're bringin' into the mix and see if it was updated 11/24 or 11/25/09?

If it's relevant (DNA-replicating, cross-kingdom infecting vector w/a patented strain that WILL hold up against its mfg or patend-holder/distributor in court, update date of 11/24 or 11/25/09), let's rock - but right now, I have to focus on the massive evidence already easily at hand for Morgies.

It's enough.

Typing these patented strains in Morgellon's Patients (before successful protocol, pls!) makes litigation and more importantly, BANNING these pesticides easier than I thought...(gonna make 'em ALL think twice!)

Those 3 sudden updates are gonna make the gavel BANG - I can't wait!!!

"Seeking Morgellon's Suspected Product Documents or Pesticide 'Fact' Sheets udpated 11/24 or 11/25/09"

"Seeking: Who's typing strains, let's ROCK!" (there's a thread on that recently, I'll yank it up)

Wishing global Butterflies!,

[Venetia]

No need to remove your post TCM- it's all good info and I was glad to
revisit the thread.

I have a 'thing' about vendors as relates to this condition due to having been
a reader/poster on the 'old' board and being inundated with all manner of snake
oil. It continues still on Morgellons boards and I find it offensive. Nine years of
vendor spam (and more).

Thing is with some of these vendors, if you don't like their product/s for any reason or if you post where the product/s can be found for less $$$- some of
the nastier vendors start messing with your computer. True story- I'll tell you
about it some time.

Just another reason I don't want to be associated with any particular 'Vendor'.

Thanks for the explanation.

~V~

[tcmgpt13]

V, I do not like the vendor syndrome I have seen developing here either and you are right, I have noticed and copied a lot of price differences on MDR about some products. Kind of makes you lose faith in the goodness of others when it seems some who post are here to sell. I am sorry if I have caused you any problems and if you ever change your mind about removing your post, just let me know, okay? It is a shame that forums are used in this way and I can understand your concerns.

Originally Posted by Venetia

No need to remove your post TCM- it's all good info and I was glad to
revisit the thread.

I have a 'thing' about vendors as relates to this condition due to having been
a reader/poster on the 'old' board and being inundated with all manner of snake
oil. It continues still on Morgellons boards and I find it offensive. Nine years of
vendor spam (and more).

Thing is with some of these vendors, if you don't like their product/s for any reason or if you post where the product/s can be found for less $$$- some of
the nastier vendors start messing with your computer. True story- I'll tell you
about it some time.

Just another reason I don't want to be associated with any particular 'Vendor'.

Thanks for the explanation.

~V~

[Enviro Girl]

Hey Venetia!

I don't know Dr. Kolb, but Precision Herbs/Overman's Healthy Choices has a successful protocol that myself and some others took last year. It's new.

I get a discount (most cos. give discounts to their regular buyers, yours should 4 U - ?) no one uses my code except me and KC - cuz that's my friend and we get a good chunk off cost. It's just for us.

I'm not getting free products for referrals or a fee or I'd be giving people a code or saying tell 'em Enviro Girl sent you or some gimmick - the forms are direct from/to them, I'm not involved in the process.

I don't do perks - cuz there's enough prostitutional promotion going on w/Big Pharma, the FDA, CDC, AMA and Washington.

No money crosses my hands - I won't even let the people that saved my life take me to lunch when I go out to meet them someday and thank them, because of all this forum libel...

I did my own consultation forms, through the mail and became a direct patient - I've still never met them, in person.

I'm not involved in the transaction or the care process. I make $0. I'm going to always keep it that way.

They have lots of distributors that have access to their products like Dr. Kolb sounds to, as they are an industry leader and global healers.

If someone tried something from Dr. Kolb years ago (I admire and thank anyone who's been working hard on Morgellon's for years, it's no easy task - I think we can all agree upon that)...

...or someone else that distributes and uses Precision's Herbs - that is like not all MD's in the country prescribing the same life-long Big Pharma for every patient:

Each care provider using one company's products/methods may not have the same results/process/cost.

I have ONLY witnessed and know of the consultations going DIRECTLY to Overman's Health Choices/patients under their direct care/their protocol being of success - 3 U.S. States, Ages 2.5 +.

Until I see others with successes I can verify in real life, for around $180 20/30 day initial protocol - you will NEVER see me suggest doing anything but DIRECT. That is what I trust.

I only speak truth, only from what I know and can personally validate in real life.

Direct through them, via mail ONLY - Their products/what they advise ONLY. I mixed no other products w/their protocol.

They are also Naturopathic Doctors/ND's that consult and help patients directly, as well as formulators and manufacturers of their own herbs, they publish educational materials and they have a school to teach other ND's.

It's kinda like going to the Surgeon General of ND's!

Direct is different than going to one of their distributors that is an ND/other alternative docs..

Morgellon's is not easy. I went w/the pros @ Overman's for my consultation and to Precision Herbs for their manufactured products only, DIRECT last year. That is what any of us is able to do.

Venetia, you seem like some kind of a pro, but for others: You can't just buy stuff from their website at random yourself cuz the name sounds cool, I said before: Naturopathy is not the Bob Villa DIY dabbling hobby - it's a precise science.

If you aren't in the industry, please don't order something from their site yourself and try to Play Pro w/out advisement and then talk trash on them.

You, too can find out what kinda Morg you've got from the PROVEN PROS and you can go get rid of IT and ITs Friends & Associates.

End of story.

For those in the industry, call 'em up - I'm sure they'll host some training so we can get everyone healing ASAP, in unison. They're really good people. There is no shame in asking them for help/coaching if it will benefit your patients, let's get you healing folks together!

Anyone that is distributing/using Precision Herbs' products for Morgellon's needs to please check in with them and Overman's Healthy Choices and make sure they are optimizing what they can do for Morgellon's patients.

I really don't want them linked w/a failed or expensive protocol from years ago...

I reiterate, what I took part in was Brand New Protocol, last winter. Direct. My actual costs and exactly what I did are on the Transgenic thread.

$85 consulation DIRECT via mail, ya buy the stuff THEY tell ya, they become your ND, just like any doctor.

Except better

They don't treat, they heal - I know it's unique to us.

I just went back for my once a year. Haven't been back since intial consult via mail, last year. I eat a bunch of junk.

Needed 4 new things/30 Days.

Not bad. $60 re-check for life, from anywhere in the globe and I go online and order what they advise/they ship it - as I go through life.

I am set. They are going to help me protect and heal my friends and family from diabetes and vertigo and everything the mainstream treats for a bunch of money.

I'm just sharing that help and experience with others, for free, like I would hope anyone who got better from Morgellon's would come back & do.

It doesn't even matter what IT is, when we get new freak GM IT's going forward - Overman's Healthy Choices are the people that took Morgellon's to the mat in late fall 2008 and beat IT.

And they are gonna be there for me. Whatever we face. I'm siked, blessed and lucky - I feel safe again, even amidst this disgusting, creepy Flavus info...

It's kind of hard not to be excited about them, after Morgellon's ruined your life since 03/25/06 and they are the people that gave you your life back

If anyone who's not a naturopath had purchased something from their site and dabbled - I'm sorry, but you can't use that to libel them if you did so without their advisement. Get a consult and let the PROS take over from here...

Direct 4 Success ONLY. At least for now.

[Bee]

EGirl, They might be good, the best even, but it still sounds like buying Hope to me.Your not cured. Is being a positive thinker part of the protocol ? Why don't you tell us what your taking, just in case it is one size fits most.

All for One and One for All ,should be our motto.
After all we are The Testers. for the rest.

[Venetia]

TCM- interesting term- 'Vendors syndrome'- I will have to remember that one. Could be the basis
of an article?

While some of the products offered by some of the vendors ARE helpful- some are downright dangerous. When I am able I will post an image of a FIR pad that melted down while I was
sleeping. Scary stuff. The control literally melted. If I had not been awake early that day and
spotted the control while making the bed- I'm not sure if I would be here.

BTW- the vendor link suggests that you sleep on the pad.

Enviro-girl,

First off- personally, I don't have the resources at present to try any new herbals.

I'm sure that Dr Overman is everything that you say he is- I just can't afford any products
at this time.

I did see his info posted in years past but the fact that his link stops you on the first page and requires membership to proceed was a turn off for me. Instead, I spent big bucks on products
such as the one mentioned above that nearly toasted me (and my house).

Now- the piggy bank is empty.

Many of those who have been long-term readers/posters recall horror stories as relates to various
vendors and even a few doctors who have treated people with this condition in the past. The 'old' board closed and wiped out all traces (ie: evidence) of the stories of those adventures. Other
related boards seem to have buried or deleted that information as well.

In any case, it makes you become cautious.

Dr Overman, now that you explain his work, seems more like a compounding pharmacist only on an
herbal level. That could be a good thing. Instead of taking 10 or more products, you could take
only the ones that you need. I really didn't understand that before.

When I get back to work or win the lottery (which ever come first), I will definitely keep Dr
Overman in mind.



~V~

[Enviro Girl]

Hey Venetia!

I thought you were some high-fallutin' genius researcher/doc, I didn't know you were one of us!!!

Kritters told me you had great info & I'd really dig ya - Already do!

I'm so sorry that happened to you w/that pad, thank gosh you caught it before it burned down the house or gotcha. Thank you for letting others know...Hope you got your money back!

The 'membership fee' came up recently, as we patients seem to have to brandish our consitutional rights to help ourselves with Morgellon's.

There aren't accompanying requirements, you don't have to be of their faith to get helped - it's a fee and a set of forms, like any doc in any office in mainstream U.S.A. would have you fill out.

Except better

I loved the questions they ask on the consultation forms about your body/true health. It's like everything you've been waitin' to be asked about, at once!

All the big players helping Morgies have some form protectional paper work now, is my understanding.

Many of the docs successfully helping Morgies have had to resort to memberships or attorney-provided forms, procedures and guidelines, they all have to kinda help us around The System.

Why? Because The Powers That Be give anyone helping Morgies a hard time. They have been for years. We know this. (Behold: the Power of Big Pharma/Big Medica).

Forms and associations (telling the GOV to mind their own biz on your health choices) is a way for any MCP (Morgie Care Provider) to be able to operate, free from corrupt agency Reindeer Games and still be able to help us.

It's our way, as patients, to be able to help ourselves. That's all.

I believe the membership fee is $10.00 and comes off your tab at purchase. I think I just paid mine, that was new since my last and initial consultation, last year.

You can ask them IF - you'll have them for personalized care, too.

That's another benefit of them...Even though it's through the mail, they're your Naturopathic Doctor/ND, then, too - They are goooood, real-life people that seriously went and will ALWAYS go to bat for us.

I'm lucky and blessed to have found them!

I'm glad I could re-check and know post-protocol - for $60...

Best $60 I ever spent - 03/08/10

Last Monday = Best Monday Ever!!!

Wishing Global Butteflies!,

VENETIA - ANY DOCUMENTS MORG-SUSPECTED AND OFFICIAL UPDATED 11/24 OR 11/25/09?! THANK YOU!