nutrients / supplements for producing collagens and keratins

[2manyfibers]

This post is based on a question from Lindalu regarding the specific supplements I took to get into the shape I’m in. I thought it would be better to condense some of the information I posted elsewhere on the web here in order to explain why the supplements caused the problem as well as the amounts I took. (I apologize for the length of the post, but wanted to provide complete information).

Collagens and keratins are the 2 major structural proteins that construct the human body (about 20% by mass) - the rest of the body is about 60% water and 20% bones and fat:

There are 27 known types of collagens produced by the body; 26 known types of keratins. As a general statement, collagens form the structural foundation for the body (including the skin, organs, blood vessels and bones), much of them in the form of fibers. Collagen fibers are the “scaffolding for skin cells (which are keratin) to attach to and are the structural “members” that form the organs – the “hollow” organs (lungs, stomach, etc) use collagen fibers to form the hollow shape. Keratins form the “flesh” and the surface of the skin as a general statement (including epithelial (which means many layers) tissue like much of the internal “flesh” of the body.

In order to make more than 50 unique types of these proteins, a pretty wide variety of vitamins, minerals and amino acids are needed in small amounts (including trace amounts of minerals like copper, boron, phosphates and others). A good multivitamin will go a long way in providing most of the vitamins and minerals needed in smaller amounts. The nutrients needed in relatively significant amounts are much fewer in number so I’ll list them as “major” nutrients. Most of the major nutrients are the same except for 2 vitamins:

Collagens require vitamin C to “activate” the production process.

Keratins require vitamin A to activate the production process (beta carotene is converted to vitamin A in the body)

The rest of the “major” nutrients for both of these proteins are as follows:

Sulfur: This is the base ingredient for production of these 2 proteins (much like flour is to baking a cake) Sulfur is considered a “macro” nutrient because relatively large amounts are needed and sulfur is found in varying degrees in many foods. Garlic, onions (of which garlic is a type), dairy products and eggs are the richest food sources of actual sulfur (although not the most “sulfur-producing” foods). Meats are the richest form of sulfur in foods overall as they contain large amounts of sulfurous amino acids (cysteine, cystine, methionine and taurine) which are used by the body to produce “nutritional” sulfur (with red meats being the richest). Vegetables and fruits generally have only small amounts of sulfur.

Zinc: Enzymes are the chemical catalysts (which initiate reactions between chemicals, nutrients in this case) that make life possible – without them, chemicals (nutrients) can’t combine to form these proteins (or any other proteins like many hormones and antibodies as well as collagens and keratins). Zinc is required to produce more than 300 enzymes in the human body including most of those necessary for collagen and keratin production (of all the 50+ types of these proteins). Zinc is the second most used metal in the body next to iron and the richest sources of zinc in food are meats (particularly red meat, but oysters are the richest food in zinc – note that meats are generally the richest sources of both sulfur and zinc from diet). Nuts and legumes (beans and peas as we say in the south) have some zinc as do dairy products, but not nearly as much as meats (and the zinc in these foods is less “bio-available” than the zinc in meats). Some cereals are also fortified with zinc. Most fruits and vegetables contain very little if any zinc.

Lysine and Proline: These are the most used amino acids in collagen and keratin production. Proline can be formed in the body from a combination of amino acids, mainly aspartic and glutamic acids. However, in addition to these amino acids, meats also contain “pre-formed” proline – the cow or pig or chicken consumed as meat already converted a combination of other amino acids into proline (this is where the term “complex proteins” comes from). Lysine is very important to producing collagens a little more so than keratins (but important for both). Meats are generally very high in lysine and other foods like potatoes and dairy products are fairly rich in lysine as well. Soybeans are the richest food in lysine, but they contain practically no sulfur. In fact, sulfur has to be artificially added to soybeans used as livestock feed because the livestock can’t develop into “healthy meat” from soybeans without sulfur. Some vegetables contain moderate to high amounts of lysine with very few being high in lysine content.

Silica and Magnesium: Silica is critical to collagen formation although it isn’t used in great amounts. It is also important for creating proline in the body. Magnesium is an important mineral in the production of enzymes (it is required for producing more than 300 enzymes in the body as is zinc, but it is not as critical to the collagen and keratin producing enzymes). As a general statement, these minerals are easier to get from dietary intake than some of the “major” nutrients listed above.

When all these nutrients including both the minor and major ones are present in the human body, DNA does its’ incredible work as the chemist that creates the enzymes that cause the chemical reactions that produce collagens and keratins and places them wherever they are needed in the body.

Now to the original question from Lindalu about the specific supplements I took that ended up creating a severe excess of these proteins in my body. I started taking vitamins in 1981 (when I was 18 years old) at the direction (more like coercion) of my college baseball coach (which according to my math means that I will turn 29 this year, and again next year, and again the year after that, etc. – maybe I’m mathematically challenged, but I sure am young!). I stuck with the basic regimen I started then and the following is the list of supplements I’ve taken daily since that time until I realized I had a major problem about 3 years ago (I’ve generally been very healthy overall). None of the amounts shown are considered to be “mega-doses” and were generally available in one pill or taken according to the manufacturers instructions:

- Multivitamin – a “standard” medium quality formulation (sometimes high quality)
- Vitamin C – 1500 mg
- Beta Carotene (vitamin A) – 25,000 IU
- Zinc – 50 mg
- Garlic – 400 mg (a very good source of sulfur and small amounts of amino acids)
- Potassium – 99 mg (1 to 2 tablets daily)
- Vitamin E – 400 IU

Around 1992, I added the following to my daily regimen above to benefit my joints. Between sports injuries and being struck with a forklift, I ended up having 8 knee surgeries prior to this time (4 of which were major reconstructions). One thing that may be worth noting here is that every foreign object used in these surgeries (including a gore-tex ligament, titanium staples and stainless steel screws) had to be removed within a few months of implant because my body physically rejected these materials. My orthopedic surgeon (who was the team surgeon for major colleges and professional teams for many years and was highly respected) told me that my immune system was simply too strong to accept the materials (even when taking “anti-rejection” drugs in high doses for several months with the artificial ligament – they didn’t suppress my immune system enough to allow my body to accept the foreign implants). In hindsight, I would imagine that my vitamin regimen had something to do with the strength of my immune system (all these surgeries were prior to adding the supplements below). I stopped taking all the supplements in late 2004 after I figured out something was wrong) – here’s what I added around 1992 or so):

- Glucosamine (hydrochloride) / Chondroiton (sulfate – more sulfur) – 1,500 mg / 1,200 mg
- MSM (Methyl-Sulfonyl-Methane) – 1,500 mg to 3,000 mg depending on pain

Of course, I didn’t know the science on how the body produces collagens and keratins until after I figured out I had a terrible problem and my symptoms (which appeared to be completely unknown), drove me to research until I had figured out what my problem was. I eventually arrived at the undeniable conclusion that I was taking generous amounts of ALL the nutrients needed to produce these 2 proteins as daily supplements (in addition to diet). I’m actually not too far removed from a carnivore as far as dietary habits go. My idea of a balanced diet is eating equally large amounts of beef, chicken and pork (I do occasionally eat a few vegetables and fruits, and a salad now and then). So I was getting lots and lots of everything needed to produce these 2 proteins directly from my diet except for vitamin C and vitamin A (which I took as supplements). The supplements I was taking (particularly the garlic, MSM, and glucosamine / chondroiton) was providing far too much additional nutritional sulfur for me and the other supplements (vitamin C, beta carotene and zinc) produced plenty of the enzymes needed to carry out the chemical reactions (with the multivitamin providing the “lesser” amounts of vitamins and minerals needed and also providing additional vitamin C, beta carotene and zinc).

Over a period of about 12 years or so, my body did what DNA naturally does with these nutrients, which is produce collagens and keratins, only in much greater amounts than normal. DNA has no method to control the overall volume of proteins produced other than the volume of nutrients consumed and how quickly the body either processes or eliminates the nutrients as waste (DNA doesn’t “know” the amounts of proteins produced – it makes specific proteins according to the nutrients required to chemically produce them for as long as the nutrients are available). Over time, excess amounts of nutrients will lead to excessive amounts of proteins being produced, just as a shortage of any of these nutrients will lead to a deficiency in the amounts (and / or quality) of the proteins produced over time. With an excess of nutrients, once these proteins are produced, the body has to put them wherever they would normally be placed, only in much greater amounts. With a deficiency of nutrients required to produce collagens and keratins (any of them) the body has to “protect itself’ by placing the proteins it does produce where they are most critical – DNA somehow “knows” that internal organs are generally more critical to life than skin (so if there aren’t enough proteins to go around, the proteins are placed where they are most critical). Most researchers now believe that the reason the body deposits cholesterol in arteries is because the body isn’t producing the amount of collagens it needs to repair and maintain the arteries (cholesterol is used as a substitute for collagens because there aren’t enough collagens to “go around”). Without the additional sulfur and glucosamine / chondroiton supplements, I don’t believe I would have ever had the problem I’ve endured because the excess “base” materials wouldn’t have been there to be "overused”.

Although I realized in late 2004 that something was wrong, I didn’t have anything resembling Morgellons symptoms until after I STOPPED taking the supplements. As long as I was “feeding” my body more of the nutrients to produce these 2 proteins, the fibers kept growing and the keratin kept forming in my skin. Once I stopped taking the supplements, the fibers began contracting and breaking in the skin (which caused the biting, stinging and crawling sensations in my case), and the keratins started “seeping” through to the surface more (because the natural process of skin formation is for “skin cells” to pass through the network of collagen fibers in the deep layers of skin (which were now degrading) to the surface of my skin where the keratins naturally form a protective “barrier”). I believe this is what caused my lesions (keratin puddles, not unlike severe psoriasis which is also known as hyperkeratosis). The vitamin A may have stayed in my system longer since it is stored in the fat cells - thus my body may have been producing excess keratins longer than the collagens (even after eliminating the supplements). It is my belief that the elimination of the supplements caused my body to basically suffer a deficiency in collagens and keratins in relative terms (the excessive amounts I had created could no longer be maintained), which brought on the symptoms that were so similar to Morgellons.

Physically, the human body literally IS a chemical reaction! One thing I figured out through my experience and research is that as a general rule, you get most vitamins and some minerals from fruits and vegetables. You get most amino acids, “complex proteins” and some minerals from meats (and to a much lesser extent legumes, nuts and dairy products – and an even lesser extent from a few vegetables). Obviously this is why a balanced diet is important; or substituting nutritional supplements for nutrients missing in less than balanced diets is equally important. Also, it is often quite difficult to get enough of many important nutrients from diet alone (like vitamin C and sometimes beta carotene, sulfur or zinc). If anyone is interested in looking up nutrients in the foods they normally eat to determine the nutrients they actually get from their diets, a very good website I found is:

http://www.nutritiondata.com

You can search by specific nutrients (like lysine or vitamin C) and generate a list of the amounts of the given nutrient in various foods (in descending order of nutrient content). Or you can search specific foods (like beef steak or broccoli) and get the nutrients in that food specifically (amino acids are usually listed as proteins). This site was very valuable in helping me determine how nutrition (my dietary habits) was a direct cause of my problem, especially combined with the nutritional supplements I took.

[EvDownJr]

Outstanding work!

This piece has to be one of the most mechanically sound contributions I have seen in a while. Must be crafted by an engineer.

Not to digress at all...One thing I picked up on here were the titanium implants and surgeries. Have spoken to so many members with some kind of intrusion to tissue. Certainly what the body detects as foreign could warp collagen production, electrical conductivity of the cells, contribute to protein-loss entropathy in the body's attempt to defend itself.

It would also make sense that the nutrients, amino acids, minerals, our bodies have become accustomed to when removed, could result in attrition and substitution from other sources.

What you have mentioned about the body substituting lipids for collagen in the case of atherosclerosis also may be a tie in. I know the last time I checked, a long time ago, my triglycerides were through the roof. Interestingly enough, Mary Leito I believe mentioned her husband sucommed to atherosclerosis. Maybe fat substitution of collagen plays a role in part of what we are experiencing.

[2manyfibers]

Hi EvD - thanks for the kind words. I guess I have to 'fess up - I am a mechanical engineer by education but most of my employment has been closer to electrical engineering (cable TV and telecommunications). One of the most interesting things I found in my research was that there is a growing body of research and evidence showing that if the body has the proper nutrients to work with, our DNA can "wreck out" cholesterol that has been deposited in arteries and replace it with the collagens that are normally used to make repairs to arteries (arteries are made mostly of collagen fibers including the "inner walls" of the arteries). Dr. Linus Pauling (a 2 time Nobel prize winner) developed a vitamin regimen for reversing heart disease that can accomplish this reversal in many if not most cases. Some of his patients who followed this protocol had suffered from clogged arteries and heart problems. When they eventually died (many of old age) autopsies on them revealed that their arteries had been "cleared" of cholesterol and repaired with the collagens that were supposed to be used. If you're interested just google "linus pauling heart disease reversal" and you'll find several sites that have his protocol. Oregon State University also has the Linus Pauling Institute which has a very good website for "micronutrient" information (vitamins and minerals):

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/

Another good website is the vitamin C foundation (a non-profit organization that promotes vitamin C based on the medical benefits). I think they carry a powdered form of Dr. Paulings protocol and the site also has loads of scientific and medical research on vitamin C. I would encourage anyone taking statins (for lowering cholesterol) to check out the following link.

http://www.vitamincfoundation.org/statinalert/

If their information has any validity (and I believe it is valid information based on what I've read in other places as well) you may want to look at alternatives to these drugs if you are on them. More than 1 study has shown that vitamin C can lower cholesterol comparably to statins without any of the negative side effects of statins (like statins depleting CoQ10 - vitamin C is used in the natural production of CoQ10 in the body). Both sites have loads of good information on nutrients.

[Gator]

Hi 2manyfibers,

Thanks for the super,duper, post of fantastic information about vitamins, minerals, collagen, keratin , foods,etc. Excellent research job. This information is very valuable for all of us to know and you have made it easy for the rest of us websites and all. Thanks so much.

Sure hope you are much better now.

Stay blessed,
gator

"A kind deed is a forever treasure in the heart of the receiver"